----- July 12th -----
evgen [15:42]
does anyone know how unit sides (called arcs in TT) work in DO?
from my observation, there are arcs in DO but I am not sure that there are 4 arcs like in TT (Front, Flanks, Rear).
There is definitely *Forward* arc - it is proved by the fact that unit moves only in direction it faces and only can spot enemies which are in front of them (have to test spider unit on 360 degree LOS btw)
There are definitely *Flank* arcs - it is proved by the fact that unit may flee if charged in flanks (and cry "Stand Firm men" when unbreakable)
What I am not sure if there is *Rear* arc in DO. Does Rear has any difference from Flanks or is it just another "flank" arc. Or may be there are just Forward (90 degrees) and one Flank (270 degrees) in DO? (edited)
evgen [15:42]
uploaded this image: image.png
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devast3d
[15:44]
Impossible to check
[15:45]
Or.. try to charge from side/rear
[15:45]
And see if battle ends differently
evgen [15:46]
I have already tried charge when tested Str bonus and it was the same +1 to Str from all sides(arcs)
devast3d
[15:47]
Any diff in panic tests?
evgen [15:49]
how to test it is the question :slightly_smiling_face:
unbreakable unit yells Stand Firm Men from both flanks and rear charge (edited)
devast3d
[15:51]
Take breakable unit which can flee
[15:52]
And see if charging fron the rear gives more chances causing panic
[15:52]
E.g. 10 tests for side and rear
[15:52]
More tests will give preciser info
----- July 13th -----
evgen [06:38]
charge in the *flank*:
8 flees out of 20 attempts
charge in the *rear*:
14 out of 20
[06:38]
so far...
evgen [07:02]
uploaded and commented on this image: Pasted image at 2017-07-13, 7:01 AM
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the funny thing is, in 4thE rules there is no difference between charge in the rear or flank
evgen [07:05]
also, unit has to be in melee combat! and in my DO tests above I have charged unit that just stand still (edited)
evgen [07:14]
either my tests are not precise and I need to make more attempts to be sure or DO devs made unit morale less resistant to rear charges.
evgen [07:23]
if the latter is true than another question emerges - how DO devs made morale less resistant to rear charge? :slightly_smiling_face: penalty to unit Leadership? or to 2d6 roll which is made every time morale is tested?
Whichever is true we have two discrepancies with TT rules already:
1. Charge to rear and charge to flanks is calculated differently
2. Unit's morale has to be tested even if unit is out of combat (edited)
evgen [07:46]
from the bright side, it proves that in DO unit has 4 arcs front, flanks and rear
devast3d
[10:46]
yeah, need more tests I guess
----- Yesterday July 14th, 2017 -----
evgen [08:56]
2nd tests:
charge in the *flank*:
5 flees out of 20 attempts (25%)
charge in the *rear*:
9 out of 20 (45%) (edited)
[08:59]
sum of both 1st and 2nd tests:
flank - 32.5%
rear - 57.5% (edited)
evgen [09:18]
during tests noticed 2 interesting points:
1. during fight models in unit can turn and spot enemies hidden unit
2. unit in wide formation (more files) has combat resolution bonus vs unit in long fomration (more ranks) (while it is vice versa in TT! where unit with more ranks has CR bonus
[09:18]
I'll provide more details on both points a bit later
devast3d
[09:51]
interesting findings
mikademus [10:09]
I'm reading this with interest. Very good testing and interesting results. To me it has always felt like the devs changed some of the TT mechanics to suit a real-time format but did a really solid job of just changing _enough_ that it still felt like the TT. This with morale testing being different from side and rear flanks is one of those, I think.
devast3d
[10:14]
@mikademus hey! haven't seen you in a long time :slightly_smiling_face:
mikademus [10:16]
I hang around and read the messages now and then. Just so bloody busy all the time, but this place is a bit like a power spot for me to recharge my faith in life and humanity :D
devast3d
[10:17]
hah, it's the same for many, including myself :slightly_smiling_face:
devast3d
[10:23]
@evgen have you noticed that reforms aren't really turn into any direction? during last DO run I think I've noticed new behavior - a unit reforms at 45 deg angles (i.e. 45, 90) to the closest direction and only then wheels further
[10:23]
evgen, check this in your next test
[10:24]
is there anything in TT which makes unit reform either 45 or 90 degrees?
[10:25]
by refoming I mean auto reform on the move
[10:25]
not shift+click reform
[10:26]
shift-reform seems to be rotating in any direction (edited)
[10:27]
and during the reform process the unit moves slowly, but don't wheel, and after all units reached their slots the unit can finally wheel to the target
[10:27]
omg, so complex :smile:
evgen [10:31]
I think I get your point:
- you point-click let's say behind unit
- unit auto-reforms (since angle exceeds its wheeling radious). Auto reform is fixed i.e. 45, 95 (this has to be checked)
- unit slowly moves while all models get to their spots
- unit accelerates and wheels to face needed movement vector
[10:34]
@mikademus @devast3d it is good to see more "alive" fellas around and I expect "resurrection" wave as soon as combat hits the first playable build :slightly_smiling_face:
mikademus [10:37]
I actually have Unreal Engine installed and I've planned for over a month to install and have a look at Resurrection to see if could contribute something too. And a lotta life happened. *sigh* Well i still have the engine installed and i still hope to be able to contribute something.
devast3d
[10:39]
@evgen yes, that's what I was thinking
1 reply 1 day ago View thread
devast3d
[10:39]
@mikademus if you want I can think out of certain small separate task for you
[10:40]
awlays better to do something rather than watching tuts mindlessly
evgen [10:52]
@devast3d 40 test attempts shown that there is difference in rear charge vs flank charge as 57% vs 32% correspondingly.
Is it enough to recognize that unit in DO has 4 sides(arcs) or should we test more?
devast3d
[10:53]
enough
[10:54]
exact percentage is still the question
[10:54]
but we certainly have the evidene
evgen [10:57]
it would be hard to discover exact formula for rear and flanks charge since there is Leadership roll probability. I suggest to come up with our own formulas (edited)
devast3d
[10:58]
agreed :slightly_smiling_face:
mikademus [11:04]
@devast3d I'll be back country on the 18th (back at my computer :p) so let's have a walkthrough around then :)
[11:06]
@evgen sounds like 66% vs 33% adjusted by leadership with leadership less influencing being charged in the rear.
